whobbies

That is appreciated. I think Rick has some interest and I will wait to see what he says. I really like the way these buggies are constucted and wish I had the time and energy to keep on it and make the repairs, but in truth I have so much competition today from Off shore (Asia) to contend with my days are longer than my start up years of 30 years ago, and I find myself doing very little on the weekends. It's terrible because I have the garage I dreamed about as a younger man, full of everything to fabricate almost anything from the ground up, just don't have that drive like I used to. I really hope one day soon that I can down size my company, home, and life demands and regain the things I used to love to do. Thank you for your offer and if I decide to keep the current engine I will contact you and also get this to Rick. Thanks, Tony

Lenny, If I don't sell it I will. Yes the diffs gotta go, no doubt about it. I am not as up to date with many drive trains of the newer cars, and I do know that they simply turned the engine and tranny side ways in the Joyners and shafted to the diffs. Yes you can cut and sleeve axles and drive shafts, but I'm not sure I want to get that far in depth. I know how strong the type 1 VW bus tranny is, and that would be a straight forward retro, and perfect turned 180 degrees, but limited to rear wheel drive. It may also allow a choice of many other engines to be used as adapters can be aquired and made relitively easy. Iwas looking at that 2.0 used in the Geo Metro, you can get re-builds for about $600.00, and the parts are very low in price, the ECU can be bought brand new for $65.00. To keep it 4WD I would have to find a quality set of diffs from something on a smaller level, and unfortunetly most small utility vehicles use straight axles front and rear. My sons had me looking at those Honda SUV's, as it has independent front and rear. I really don't want a big project to undertake and there is some interest in purchasing it as-is, and I will probably consider that first. For you guys out west 2WD is not such a good idea, but for us here in Florida for the most part it's OK. We do have a lot of sugar sand but with enough HP and the right tires you can easily get through it. We have lots of trails and they are considerably harder sand, and the Joyner is the perfect size.

Kind of sucks no doubt, that's one thing I did not know about. I'm going to pull the engine and drive train tonite and considering putting a type 1 VW tranny in reversed, and then either a 1600 (worked) type 1, if there is enough room or a 2.0 from something with a tranny adapter. I know I will loose the 4WD, but Hell I'll put something with 100+ HP and some balloon tires in front that will more than make up for it. We don't have any hills here in Florida and it's mostly mud and or sand. Who needs 4WD if the front tires are not on the ground? I like the chassis and the size of the buggy for trail use, just need to put a reliable engine and power train in it and I think it can be a nice machine. I was blown away when I saw the size of the U-Joints, never paid any attention to them. There are bigger U-joints on my Kawasaki Mule and that only has 22 HP! If I can come up with an alternative I will contact you make the engine available to you.

Rick, Thanks I ordered all the parts. Tony

Yep is see, not mine it is a diferent set-up. Similar except a small pin not the larger shaft. I did order the lever assembly on ebay and will figure something out. Thanks much appreciated. Tony

Rick, I have a 4-5mm shaft sticking out of the diff about 3/4". Yours looks to be about 1/2". Is that factory or is this something you made? Thanks, Tony

Rick, I checked it out and maybe I'm not sure what it looks like. I saw the lever and spring, and a plate. Is there the mechanics that bolt to the diff? Thanks, Tony C.

I'll check it out thanks. The lever is the easy part it's the mechanics to actuate the pin that's going to be a challenge. I don't want to just make a bracket because it must be water tight, so by using the existing housing because it is designed with a O-ring seal and adding a inner work mechanism and a cover plate may be the easist fix. Thanks, Tony C.

Good idea using the existing box, I think I'm OK now and will try to make a gimble and plate that can be water-tight. Unfortunetly it's always easier to pull than push, but I/m sure I can figure something out. Please make no special trips I can get something to work. I did see the one someone made but my concern was keeping water and mud out of the output section, but by using the existing box it should be pretty straight forward. Thanks, Tony C.

I think I called yesaterday and they had none comming in, so as hard as this is to believe I purchased another of the electric one's???? I think I will make a simple overload circuit to protect it in the event of a over-limit. I will take your advice and call agian as I did not speak to this person. I was also told that there were no diff gears scheduled to come in, and that is hard to believe since it is such a troublesome issue. Thanks, Tony C.

Mike, Good write and I am sure there is truth to it and it can't hurt to tell the truth. It's a shame how many good ideas don't come to be over ego, pride, and greed. We as Americans are a country of folks that don't give up for the most part. I hate it when one of my products receives complaints, and it doesn't take several hundred or thousand returns, and me trying to recoupe my companies investment for me to change. I have been known to stop production on a product, or at the very least talk to my engineers and re-test on a personal level with a single complaint. In America most of us business owners fear the fact that they may be out of business any day, and that has included me of the past 30 years. I don't see the fear in the offshore companies, and some are so deversafied that Hell, if the dune buggy fails to sell we still have generators, sewing machines, and so on. Sometimes they are affended when I tell them of a problem, and more-so when I offer a solution. But not all are like this, and many are beginning to hear what you and I are saying. I have a relationship with an awesome company in China, one that is now going on almost 15 years. The owners have visited me and my family at my home in Florida and vice a versa. They always send me samples and ask me if there is anything that can be done to make the products better. I think they always had this way about them, but I continue to tell them of the importance of satisfing the customers with support and of course support parts, so we can have a long lasting business, which has turned into a friendship. By having them come to the US has really opened thier eyes and have given them a different perspective, and let me tell you guys , they have an unbelievable respect for the US, and all they want as people is the same from us and to be able to enjoy life and an economy similar to ours. My Chinese friend could not believe their influence when I took him to Walmart, we made a game of trying to find some or at least a single product that did not come from China, he was blown-away. I look at it like this. You can't have it all forever, but we as Americans can't afford to loose it all forever either. China started coping my R/C model boats back in 2000 lead by one of my /our own US distributers, and so we are all on the same page, we can't blame China alone, I can safely say that most domestic products were brought overseas to be copied within our own domestic industries, by the people we once did business with for many years. This was a snowball effect that has been taking place for the past two decades in almost every industry. What started as greed has become a real problem and a unfair playing field if you are a US based business with US personel such as us. However, with this said it has been almost 12 years and we are still in business and doing business, even though 180 degrees away, it is to be considered overall competition that requires constant innovation, and you have to address it with more quality, service, and pride, just like if your competitor was on the same turf. I am glad to see all these guys talking on this subject. Now one or more of you smart guys go get yourself a lathe and a milling machine, (Harbor Freight sells some pretty good a cheap one's , and guess what they are made in China) and make some parts for these vehicles, it feels good to put a "Made-In-America" sticker on, I know. I'll buy the first manual 4WD actuator. Thanks, Tony C.

Mike, On occaision I will stand in front of a meat market on the streets in China and look at the carcusses in the window. Yes most are recognizable but some I could look at in doubt which I coined a phrase with a friend a few years back that has stuck in the hobby business that fits well with both the meats being sold and also some products being made. We call it...."Looks like, could be"

NO that's not it, I know why he moved.... OK guys what's more important to us (most of us anyway) than motorcycles and off road toys?

Rick, I'll take $5000.00 for it. I also have some spare parts like a starter, cables, some hydrolics. Here's what is wrong. By the way it runs great. I also added a good quality K&N filter piped up. 1)- Time to address the diffs, I have one kit that I will include. (shims, hardware the $100.00 kit) 2)- Front 4WD actuator crapped-out The condition is great as well, it s yellow. Has the spare tire mounted on the rear cargo thing. Tires are in good condition at least 60% left. It's a nice product just too much for me with my life demands to keep up on it. We also live in a sugar sand area and I think I am going to get her an automatic 4WD big 4-wheeler, one of those family models. Thanks, Tony

Yea I'm getting there, can't see straight anymore, can't spell (never could), I always hired people better than myself, and got away with it for over thirty years now. I beginning to wonder how long I can go on, I'm having a difficult time finding the smarter younger ones.

Sorry?

Rick, Just found out that the company we use does not ship vehicles. There are many in the US that do so no crating is required. I will have my office make a few calls, and you may do the same if you want. Our zip code is- 33852 and we are located in Lake Placid Florida. I have a loading dock and fork lift so loading is no problem. The weight is 1800 pounds I think. Length about 8' and width about 5'. That should be enough info for a solid quote. You can always call me at: 800 444-1995 Just let the girls know what it is in reference to. Thanks, Tony C.

What is your zip code? Thanks, Tony C.

I wasn't sure how my advice would be accepted, and thought I may have over-stepped my bounds, but worth taking the chance to let you know as well as any other manufacture whom reads this, and is looking for our business to know that we are on the ball, and they better be as well. Klung wants to be trusted and that must be earned, no harm intended in any way, I am repling to a solicitation. I am glad to be able to share any experiences both good and bad with anyone who wants to listen. I am regarded as one of the most innovative person in my industry and that is not self proclaimed, that is due to a steller 30 year business and service record, and helping other hobbiests be successful whether with my product or a competitiors. With that said I still recommend potential customers to do their homework and not just listen to what I say but other hobbiests and manufacturers to make an educated decision. The part about Ken spending a great deal of time in the factory (s) is exactly what I meant and have done to forge a relationship as equal to one that you may have with the shop that repairs your personal cars. So though I do not know Ken I aplaud his dedication and I am sure we will all see QC and improvements as the years go by. Too many guys/engineers tend to spend too much time in the KTV's....LOL, Ken will know what I mean. I will stop talking now and look for some parts to repair my Trooper. Thanks, Tony C.

Same here, third gear has to be dead on, yours too?

I can ship it to you, my company gets great rates, I could always check. It feels like the shifter binds, I may have to disconnect each cable to see if that is where the friction is? Let me know if your friend is interested. Thanks, Tony

I am Tony C. owner of Warehouse Hobbies Inc. a 30 year hobby manufacture in the US. I also like toys and purchased a Joyner Trooper mainly for the wife and Grand kids to blast around on the weekends. Anyway I too am experiencing the typical problems I have heard from many on this great site, and I would like to thank those who have chimed in on my account as well. I just read a forum about a manufacture attempting to sell parts from China direct to us. Please understand while this may be very tempting you have to be very careful doing so, not as much as the manufacture not sending you the parts, but more of the wrong parts, or even worse ill-tested parts. Now this manufacture may very well be a good one, but I can attest that after spending the past 20 years doing business (mainly injection molds) with China you have to know who you are dealing with, the word "trust" is thrown around lightly, and face to face eye contact is well worth the 27 hour one way plane trip. Shipping for anything that weights more than 10 pounds is insane by EMS post (air), and consolidation by sea can yeild you with plenty of parts that may not be able to be sold, or used. I am also concerned with the quotes provided, especially the one for $350.00. The company is using ebay or other internet means to establish a US selling price when in fact that part more than likely cost 1/3rd at the most and probably less to manufacture. A quality importer would pay less than $100.00 for that part, such as a ECU. If you try to deal direct than price negotiation is in perfect order. Lets face it the pay scale in China today is $8-10 per day not hour. I am not trying to upset this manufacture I would just like all my Joyner friends to understand what is taking place now with direct China to the US business. Also know that in 99.9% of the cases that you pay up front by TT or Paypal, and getting a refund is almost non-existant. I have contacted one of the companies I deal with in China to get a little bit of info about the one contacting us here. There are many, many factories over there and one copies another, (and you thought we were the only one's being copied). The problem is lack of testing, they don't have the places like we do to use the vehicles, or operate them the way some, OK most of us do. I once went to a factory in China where they tested 1/5th scale gas radio controlled buggies in a flat parking lot 1/2 the size of a football field. These buggies are designed to be jumped and run at speeds over 60 MPH, what kind of testing can be done on a black top parking lot that equals off road abuse? Needless to say after selling a few thousand pieces around the world they are no longer in business. The sad part is the buggy wasn't too bad it just needed a little changes here and there, sort of like Joyner, but the wrong people were at the helm... Unless there is a representitive whos best interest (ass and or wallet) is on the line, frequently visiting the factory after the "correct" engineering and testing has been done, problems are very likely. We are a nation of repair-aholics, and they also can not seem to understand the importance of spare parts, not yet anyway. After enough of them fail for not properlly making spare part runs like the small Chinese Quad epidemic we had upon us a few years ago maybe they may soon get it... What happened to the 10 million that were imported from 2006-2008? Those are real numbers. The last time I visited one of the largest manufactures for those products in Northern China, the giant factory looked like a ghost town. One of the ladies in the office asked me why not so popular in the US anymore? I told her when you make a customer buy an entire chain to get a master link, you will loose the customer, She didn't get it. Sometmes we assume that because a company that makes the product cares about our well being and our success with it, and in cases like my company where I am an enthusist of my products, some do. I have found that has not been the case when dealing with China without US or other countries influence for the most part, and again that's not to say in the future when their economy permits them to purchase their own Joyner buggies and they find themselves stranded in the woods with it, that they won't start improving their quality, because that and closing up shop my friends is usually the only things that kicks a manufacture in the ass about addressing what needs to be done to make improvement. I hope to pass a little bit of education to those reading this so the excitment of a prospect of finding that hard to get part doesn't end up costing you more money and grief. For me, even with all my years of import experience (hobby products) I think I will wait for some of our US Joyner distributers containers to arrive. Sinceerly, Tony Castronovo President, Warehouse Hobbies Inc. American Hobby Manufacture since 1981 Some call us a Dinosaur.....and you know what happened to the Dinosaurs...

Our Troopers shift mechanism is very tight and the cables are all pretty new and in good condition, it's lubricated but it is still very stif to operate, is this normal? If not can someone give me a clue to what would cause this? I tried the obvious that's why I'm asking. Thanks, Tony

Guys I'm a manufacture in the hobby industry and have a good friend and very good bearing supplier in the US. The company is called, Boca Bearings in Florida. Give Mike a call and ask him to source the bearings we need, he is able to provide great prices and also get hard to find bearings. The owner is Alan and he has been in the bearing business for over 40 years now. I'm going to give him a call too, haven't spoke in a while. Tell Mike or Alan that Tony from Warehouse Hobbies sent you. I purchased a Trooper for my wife and it seams to be turning into another hobby, and I don't need another hobby... I too am starting to have problems with the diff(s), and the 4 WD actuator has crapped-out again, now the third one. I guess I am going to have to design a manual one?