2009 Hisun 700 - Seized starter? Oil in starter?

[RickinMT]

2009 Hisun 700.

Well, back to square one.

I've been doing this rebuild since Jan. 2021. MANY new parts and fixes and re-starts and working/then broke/then working/then broke... and on and on. Last week I had a good ride, about 18 miles. Ran great. Parked in the garage for 2 days and then the exact same problem as last time-- Cranks and cranks, about 6 or 8 times, and then click: nothing. I get one click and a red warning light on the dash but it's too small and doesn't say what it is. It's not the battery: it's fully charged. Had it on a charger overnight afterward and still getting one click. It's like the starter is stuck or the engine is seized. The last time it happened I took it to a guy who's rebuilt many of these and he found the starter was full of oil! Black oil. He said it was black 'cause it got cooked trying to crank. Put in a new starter and he did all kinds of adjustments and between him and the neighbor it was running great. Now it's stuck again. I'll pull the starter when I calm down....

One of the MANY new parts we threw at it was a new battery. it's got plenty of power, 350 cold cranking amps. Is it possible to have TOO heavy a battery?

But has ANYONE run into this?

 

 

 

[RickinMT]

Well the good news is, the starter's not full of oil this time. Bad news is, the connection point is melted inside. I'm thinking something jammed inside the crankcase and the started was trying to turn against the jam and melted.

 

[Savage3]

Put wrench on crank, turn engine manually. See if it is seized.

[Joe Breaux]

ditto  .....see if its seized , and why.  another member here had the transmission blow up and come thru the block, locking up crank 

[RickinMT]

Yup--- Did that today. It turns easily in one direction and slow-but-sure in the opposite direction: compression. But it does move so it's not seized.

I fished a piece of a ball cage out of the oil filler spout several months ago and I've always felt that there must be other metal junk down in the case. I had a guy working on it but he didn't have an indoor place to take the crankcase apart to check. He did get it all timed and valves set right and it ran good once or twice. The last ride was about 18 miles with no problems. Then it sat in the garage for 2 days and wouldn't start: just cranked and cranked. Until it locked up, I guess from the starter melting. But I didn't crank long, just 6 or 8 normal cranks and was about to give up but it locked and smoked. So ... there it sits.

 

 

 

[Savage3]

Interesting, the rest of the cage bearing must be in the case. Not good! Did you drain oil from engine when you found cage in spout? If not, do so and meticulously inspect oil for foreign matter.

Did you turn motor over several revolutions by hand? Did you hear or feel any grinding or resistance? Remove spark plugs prior to test.

 

What is voltage at signal wire of starter when turning key to start position.

You may have two issues, electrical and mechanical.

[RickinMT]

9 hours ago, Savage3 said:

Interesting, the rest of the cage bearing must be in the case. Not good! Did you drain oil from engine when you found cage in spout? If not, do so and meticulously inspect oil for foreign matter.

Did you turn motor over several revolutions by hand? Did you hear or feel any grinding or resistance? Remove spark plugs prior to test.

 

What is voltage at signal wire of starter when turning key to start position.

You may have two issues, electrical and mechanical.

Oil change--- I didn't. It went to a mechanic and he did all kinds of work on valves, etc., had the valve cover off and did some things... (I know Jack about engines so I leave it to more knowledgeable people).  He did say he didn't see anything in the oil when he drained it. I had told him about the ball cage and he didn't find any debris or metal shavings . I don't know for sure if he emptied out the oil or not. I plan to borrow a neighbor's magnet/stick today and fish it down in the oil spout and see if it brings anything up.

I will try again to turn it with the plug out and try and do several revolutions.  I'll check voltage, too.

Thanks.