Quantcast
Jump to content

2016 Massimo MSU500 Setting Top Dead Center


res2fr
Go to solution Solved by Ben1098,

Recommended Posts

I have an issue and I'm hoping that someone can help with a little Wisdom. I have a 2016 Massimo MSU500 UTV that blew a time chain while out riding. It has been torn down to replave the chain and Sprocket amount other things that will be renewed. The problem comes in with setting Top Dead Center on the motor. The Manuals all teel one to line up hash marks on the flywheel with a point on the side cover under what's referred to in several place as a manhole cover. Its a large headed cap/bolt that unscrews and allows you to view the edge of the flywheel. There are hash marks on the flywheel that your supposed to turn the crank until you get the proper alignment between a certain hash mark and a reference point on the Case. Problem is there is NO reference point on the case there. I also have another 2016 MSU500 and a 2014 Coleman 500. Not one of these machines have a reference mark of any kind in that location. (I have pictures if needed) 

  I know I can use the old pull the valve covers and rotate the crank and rely on getting the right point where Both Intake and Exhaust valves are closed at hopefully the correct point in the piston stroke. Is there any other reference point that could be used for this or is this the only thing left to use for finding TDC? Gotta Love documentation that doesn't match the equipment it's supposed to be for, any help would be greatly appreciated. Even if just to tell me that's about my only option. 

 

Thanks to all who even take the time to read my rambling question.

Robert

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Solution

Remove the spark plug.  Rotate the engine until the piston is at the top of travel by using a copper wire (soft 10 AWG with rounded end down) and watch the travel up and down.  When very close to TDC, the piston will stop going up and "stall" for a bit and then start to fall back down.  Rotate "between these two positions" and you have TDC.  Easier said than done.  A dial indicator can also be used if you have the set up.  Getting into the fan side is a pain with the cover.....bolt screw nut inserts usually "spin".  Easiest is to take off the belt cover exposing the drive clutch pulley.  On the rim of the pulley you can make an narrow ink mark (or tape with a ink pen line).  Do the rock back and forth to find the "going up"   and    the "going down" location on the case.  Mark the two locations.  In the middle is TDC.  Also, try to see if you can find the timing marks noted in the service manual and mark both with paint for future use.

I had a simple trick (POSTED) to hold the chain in place and keep it from falling off the crank sprocket when installing the cam gear.....string pulled for a 3rd hand.  I like to do a double check after timing the cam and then rotate to the OVERLAP (EXHAUST VALVE closing and INTAKE VALVE just opening) at the other TDC than Compression.  Always rotate slowly by hand to check for valve interference.  If something is wrong, you don't bend any valves.  Rotate the decompression flyweights against the spring return to avoid being fooled by the cam's AUTO decompression mini-cam/button hitting the cam follower.

  • Thanks 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Alex changed the title to 2016 Massimo MSU500 Setting Top Dead Center
On 12/13/2023 at 6:09 PM, motojoe said:

Look at the "Man Hole" threads and you will find a cut into the threads, line this up to the flywheel timing marks and that will be your TDC.

Thank you for the reply and option to check. Unfortunately, I have 2 2016 MSU500s and 1 2014 Coleman 500 and None of them have such a marking but it was worth checking. I dug out my Endoscope hooked it up to my Cell phone and did a direct visual, 360 degrees and no mark. But then the manuals show reference points that don't exist. I'll probably try the Old physically locate TDC and go from there the best I can.

 A.

Robertgain, thank you for your time and input 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

On 12/9/2023 at 3:58 PM, Ben1098 said:

Remove the spark plug.  Rotate the engine until the piston is at the top of travel by using a copper wire (soft 10 AWG with rounded end down) and watch the travel up and down.  When very close to TDC, the piston will stop going up and "stall" for a bit and then start to fall back down.  Rotate "between these two positions" and you have TDC.  Easier said than done.  A dial indicator can also be used if you have the set up.  Getting into the fan side is a pain with the cover.....bolt screw nut inserts usually "spin".  Easiest is to take off the belt cover exposing the drive clutch pulley.  On the rim of the pulley you can make an narrow ink mark (or tape with a ink pen line).  Do the rock back and forth to find the "going up"   and    the "going down" location on the case.  Mark the two locations.  In the middle is TDC.  Also, try to see if you can find the timing marks noted in the service manual and mark both with paint for future use.

I had a simple trick (POSTED) to hold the chain in place and keep it from falling off the crank sprocket when installing the cam gear.....string pulled for a 3rd hand.  I like to do a double check after timing the cam and then rotate to the OVERLAP (EXHAUST VALVE closing and INTAKE VALVE just opening) at the other TDC than Compression.  Always rotate slowly by hand to check for valve interference.  If something is wrong, you don't bend any valves.  Rotate the decompression flyweights against the spring return to avoid being fooled by the cam's AUTO decompression mini-cam/button hitting the cam follower.

Thank you for your input on physically establishing TDC as I had started working on that already. But I like your suggestion to use the Rim of the Drive Clutch by marking IT once you find the 3 points that you need. I've noticed references to the Firing Range in the manual when dealing with the Flywheel Markingbut have found no further info on what that is. I'll try creating my own TDC marks and Range of sorts.

Ill also look for your post on your trick to keep the Chain in place if it's still available.

 

Again, I thank you for sharing your ideas.

Robert

Link to comment
Share on other sites

12 hours ago, Steve G. said:

I'm betting the marks are there just very easy to miss as they fly by that hole when looking and turning the shaft. My motor actually has some leading marks a V mark, the mark is TDC.

 

I have no real problem finding the marks on the Flywheel on any machine. The one I'm working on now has a new flywheel on it, made for High output Stator. It is a little tougher because that outer edge is very thin and so the mark is Small. but thank you for your input. They do fly by that Timing Hole quickly. I fine my more easily now that I'm using my Endoscope camera on my Cell phone. I just mount the camera, aiming at the hole and watch the Video on my phone. The hardest part here is getting that little camera mounted in place and stationery, have to get inventive at times.

Again thank you for your time and input.

Robert

Link to comment
Share on other sites

In case you cannot find the chain trick:

Tie a nylon string (I like braided) to the top of the chain loop.  Position the bottom of the chain on the crank gear and they pull up on the string.....tie off onto the SxS roll cage or a storage shelf above if working on a bench assy.  The string tension keeps the the chain on the lower crank gear.  Next, you slide the cam gear onto the cam (no bolts yet as it can rotate BUT get it close to the timing mark.  "Stretch" the string and use a pick to milk on the chain onto the cam gear.  Use an extension to push and mimic the tensioner and check timing marks.  If off a tooth, milk it to the correct position.  The extra 3rd hand.......Rotate the engine  slightly and check for the cam gear to follow......still on the lower gear.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

  • Similar Topics

    • By Hi sun 500
      hello everyone, i just joined this forum to try my luck, few days ago i bought an old (dont know exactly), 2011/14 hi sun 500cc ""carburated"",  was not running at the time, but i fell was a good deal and decided it to bring it home to play with it, this is the issue, i bought and installed a new carb, and pump, i repositioned the battery location and upgraded to a "car batt", reconnected the fuel lines and started it, but it only runs with the choke ON, i checked the bowl, it does have fuel,but for some reason wont inject it to run, i came across a video that say that ""the body small tank had to be connected for the cart to run" (was deleted when bought), sure enough i got it to run sporadically , but the so called ""small body tank'' often runs out of fuel and wont refill itself , i had to couple times do it manually, so how does that small tank works ?..what does it do?..and why if  bypass it , the cart wont start?....any help?..thanks so much!!!
    • By JSmojo
      I've been looking at various types of UTVs in the 400-700cc range. It seems that Massimo has a really good price point but I don't know much about their reliability and availability of parts. Been looking specifically at their T-Boss 550. I've heard the parts might be an issue because the network is smaller, but couldn't find much info from owners.
      Here are a few specific questions about them
      1. In your opinion, are the reliable? Specifically, have you hand any parts break that in your mind shouldn't have? 
      2. If you had one and got rid of it, what was the reason? 
      3. If you don't recommend Massimo, what would you recommend (even if it costs a little more)?
      4. How easy is it to find a place to service them? How easy is it to get parts if you want to service it yourself? 
      If you have any other advice, I would appreciate it. I'm also looking at the Hisun Sector 550.
    • By Smittay
      (posted a similar question to the Hisun folks) Looked at a lot of UTVs lately. Couple Questions about Massimo. Some people say they are just cheap with no customer service. Other people seem to have no problems with them.
      Any opinions on Massimo durability?
      Heard parts might hard to get. Is that true?
      What models are the best?
      If you had one and didn't like it what do you recommend? 
    • By Chucky 1
      I purchased a new 2023 Landmaster UTV L4 in October of 2023.  UTV didn't seem to have as much power of the demo L4 that I drove but figured once it broke in it would be better.  After about a week the unit started bogging down backfiring and stopping.  Gas fumes really bad, wait a few minutes and it would start up again.  Brought it back to the dealer and after keeping it for a few weeks said he couldn't find anything wrong with it.  Got it back home and it started acting up again, brought it back to dealer a week later and he said he found couple things that might cause it to do run bad and he was able to replicate the issue but didn't really know what was wrong.  Got it back home again after being at dealer for several weeks and the unit started running bad again right away.  Brought it back to dealer and he went back and forth with Kohler about possible fixes but just checked somethings and try to swap a few parts but still runs bad.  I called Landmaster HQ to speak with someone about a refund and was told that was handled at the dealer level.  Dealer called Landmaster and they told him they didn't do refunds or exchanges especially with units that had problems.  The dealer is now trying to get a new engine to but I have not heard anything as of yet.  I did file complaint with Better Business Bureau and they accepted my claim and reached out to Landmaster.  The National Service Manager called me and said the he had been contacted by the BBB about the complaint and he would look into it.  I told him that I would just like to have my down payment of $2,000.00 returned and never mind the over $1,000.00 I have paid in notes for a UTV that I cannot even ride on without hoping it gets me around the neighborhood.  I have found out that the 2024 Landmaster UTVs will have Vanguard engines due to issues with the Kohler engines.  Very disappointed in what is "Proudly Made in the USA" and the way Landmaster has treated this disabled veteran! 
    • By KMart
      I have a Massimo 400 Buck that overheats and the antifreeze blows out of the motor everywhere! I don’t have to be doing anything but just driving through the field.  It only has 26 miles on it.  I don’t think the fan is turning to cool the motor.  Any ideas how to fix this?
×
×
  • Create New...