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Travis

Ol' Reliable ain't charging

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The 550 isn't showing that it is charging the battery. I've noticed its been sluggish starting.

 I tested DC at the battery, 11.35 when not running, 11.35 when running.

I'm looking through the shop manual at the diagnostic tests to narrow it down. And check all connections.

 When i took the engine out i had to cut the alternator wires, but i reconnected them with crimp connectors and shrink tube... maybe its corroded.

 

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Connections look good, I printed out the troubleshooting, it says most have to be done with  a fully charged battery , so I'm charging it.

I did a resistance test on the alternator, the spec is between 0.2 and 0.4 

 I was getting like 23.45  and 22.5.........sooo we'll see. It is 19 years old.....

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5 minutes ago, Jeremy .... said:

Sounds like a good excuse to buy a new model

sure!

I'f  you're paying! lol

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I paid just over $7000 for my 2006 610 when it was new, my new pro mx was just over $10,000 and I think it was worth it, but I also sold the 2006 for $2700.  The largest dealers have the bigger discounts

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The alternator is working correctly, 43 volts on both wires which is Spec'd.

So I'm going to test the rectifier / regulator next.

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Here is the 2 pages of regulator checking. figured i post them up so you can see what i need to do in case i have any questions.

MULEVOLTAGE.jpg

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TRY THIS TEST

connect a 40W light bulb (incandescent...not LED) across the output legs of the alt.....unloaded voltage might be 40 Vac BUT if windings have bad connections, the output voltage will be well below the 15Vac needed to forward bias the rectifier diodes......  .5 to .6 Vdc PLUS the battery voltage.  if alt output is OK, the bulb should glow dimly and get brighter as RPM is increased.  confirm alt output good before rectifier testing.

print from manual too small to read....but gathered you have a single phase (2 wire.....A1 and A2).  If replying back also show the schematic for the alt. windings and the .3-.4 ohm winding resistance...go back to the cut crimp (very bad idea on high current applications.....solder back in place.

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Thanks for the tips ben!

I'll get back to it tomorrow or Monday. Been feeling sickly.

 

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Regulator Circuit Inspection Test

Please the attached pictures.

  1.  A1 to B= 0.123
  2. A2 to B= 0.121..... if i understand it right, this one should have been 100 times higher than the first "A1 TO B"
  3. A1 to G= Nothing
  4. A2 to G=Nothing
  5. B to A1=Nothing
  6. B to A2=Nothing
  7. G to A1= .120
  8. G to A2= .120 

DSC_9251.thumb.JPG.5488235fdb053272b9b2c8e683b61e55.JPG

  1. DSC_9250.thumb.JPG.472685781cb06b43ee7063f4c988d06a.JPGDSC_9252.thumb.JPG.170c8a97f4bb6c509a510db3d367c176.JPG

 

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After reading again, i think i was supposed to do everything + lead to here, and - lead to here. then do the same, but put the - lead where the + lead went...after reading the  text in the last picture.... ?

:D    

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2 hours ago, Travis said:

Next test will be this.IMG_20200219_124319.thumb.jpg.4a251e8ad462dd5df65038e88907be6c.jpgIMG_20200219_124323.thumb.jpg.0f97f73dfb4b35e70ea68ef247226c63.jpg

This and 2 other tests from the manual shows the Regulator as the culprit.

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how did the alt output test go?  Both the low R value of .2 ohm or so AND the 40 W light bulb load test running motor.

I hate the old Kaw manuals that use a meter using ohms for a test for electronic modules......the reading is with the OEM Kaw meter...others will give different readings.  Best bet is to use a meter with a DIODE function.  This setting pumps 1 ma of current to check the FRONT to BACK ratio of the diode......that is .5 to .6 V in the forward direction and OPEN (OL) in the reverse direction.

There will be 4 diodes....not 6......in this regulator with SCRs for the voltage output control.  The rectifier diodes need to be tested both FORWARD and REVERSE = 8 tests.  you should find A1 has 2 FRW (.5 v) connections BUT they will have the leads reversed.  Same goes for A2 input......In a nut shell, the A connection(s) has a POS and NEG diode EACH.  3 phase units will have 6 diodes with +/- diodes to the 3 YEL-YEL-YEL inputs from the alt.  Look in a Honda manual for the internal components if interested.

1.  Test as such Meter RED + lead to A1.     Meter BLACK - to the B (this goes to the BATTERY?)....this would be Forward with .5 v drop across the diode.  Next interchange the RED / Black leads.  Note what the display has with the meter leads open....you should see the same display when connected this time.  Repeat for A2 FR / BK and get same .5 v /open.

2.  Next do the A1 and A2 to G wire in the connecter......results should be opposite as these are the NEG diodes this time. 

Where does the M wire go....my guess it is switched +12vdc.....that is nothing VOLTS and then =12V (battery voltage) with KEY ON.

if it does what I guess its for.....this gives the loaded system voltage and works better than using the ground as a charge reference....think voltage drop in the Gnd wiring length of wire.

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stator has good output.....PLS solder the cut wires and get rid of the butt splices....trouble down the road.

Go to REG/RECT connector.  Chase the 3 wires that are not A1 and A2 stator inputs.

G wire (according to the ohm test) would be the battery + terminal.

B wire would be the battery - terminal.

you need good connections from end to end to pass the charging current....same went for the stator powering the light bulb.

find an old headlight with one good filament intact.  Put on leads and touch to the battery posts.....should burn bright.

Do same for B and G at the REG/RECT connector.......this tests the current carry capacity of the harness....5A or so....to pass the reg output to charge the battery.....should burn very close to same brightness.....there is some wire losses in the harness wires.  If bright....AOK

Next the M wire.....I asked of it went to the IGN sw ON terminal...IF it does, it should be open OFF and +12V (battery) with key ON.  This voltage is required for the REG section of the module.

 

TEST AND REPLY BACK 

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