cliffyk

It would appear to be a  front "Rollway Assy" (a magnetic clutch of some sort) ) as used in a Strike800 and other similarly sized models.  $235 from alpha-sports.com. (I'm a retired mechanical engineer, research is a big chunk of engineering)...

y

What year/model Hisun?

11 minutes ago, Travis said:

nope, Klein selectable set on DC 20 max

It has to read something--while cranking it should detect at least 0.0 to 0.5 V (0.0 is not likely as that would indicate no resistance in the path--not possib;le in the real world).

Are you 100% certain?

One lead (red or black, doesn't matter) to the + battery post and the other to the + terminal on the starter motor. NO ground or -battery  connection...

Crank  long enough for the meter to stabilse (3 to 5) seconds.

3 minutes ago, Travis said:

the only thing is my meter will not read voltage going from + to + or - to -.....

i suppose i could check from battery+ to ground while cranking, and then from starter + to ground?

Is it one of those damned auto-function /auto-ranging meters? They often react too slowly and get confused--can it be locked into reading volts?  Preferably in a 0-5 V or so range...

32 minutes ago, Joe Breaux said:

the crawfish or the gators? 

The gators...

I once was fishing from the shore and a 5 or 6 footer followed the lure in to 25 feet or so offshore, than turned and swam off. I did this a few more times and on the 4th or 5th cast he followed it in and dived instead of swimming off--I made a hasty retreat; those guys can move pretty fast for a bit even out of the water...

1 minute ago, Travis said:

is that with key on or while cranking?

Both are while cranking to place a load on the wiring-- no current flow = no voltage drop and it's the drop under load we care about.

1 minute ago, Travis said:

so black lead to +battery and red lead to + starter, correct?

Or vice versa. with a digital meter it doesn't matter--one way you'll get positive value--tother way a negative reading. It's the magnitude that's important...

6 minutes ago, Travis said:

ah okay, i gotcha. now

You can do similarly with the ground path, black lead to the negative battery post, red lead to the starter body. This indirectly tests the integrity of the ground path--again 0.0 V would be perfect, 0.2 to 0.5 acceptable, more than 0.8 bad... 

Please make the measurement I described last:

"between the + battery post and the + post on the stater? In a perfect world that measurement should be 0.0 V--I.e. no voltage loss between  the battery and the starter.

Note: there is no connection to "ground" or the negative battery terminal in this test. Red lead to the + battery post, the black lead to the +starter terminal. This is somewhat counter-intuitive, however we want to measure the voltage difference between those points--it is an indicator of the circuit resistance.

[quote]

Also, what is he voltage between the +battery post and the +terminal on the starter while cranking/trying to crank it over? (this tests the voltage drop, an indicator of the resistance of all wiring, solenoid contacts, etc between in battery and starter..

11.90 while cranking

[/quote]

11.90 v would be very odd. Are you sure you measured between the + battery post and the + post on the stater? In a perfect world that measurement should be 0.0 V--I.e. no voltage loss between  the battery and the starter.

Note: there is no connection to "ground" or the negative battery terminal in this test. Red lead to the + battery post, the black lead to the +starter terminal. This is somewhat counter-intuitive, however we want to measure the voltage difference between those points--it is an indicator of the circuit resistance.

In the real world 0.2 to 0.5 V would not be unusual, much more than 0.6 to 0.8 V means a bad wire, connection and/or contacts.

All batteries have an quite low internal resistance. A typical lead acid battery in good condition will have a resistance of 3 to 5 mΩ (0.003 to 0.005 Ω).

The "under load" voltage drop tests I described are much better at identifying poor wiring and connections than any (low current/low voltage) ohmmeter tests. Faulty connections can often measure 0 Ω with a multi-meter but actually have significant resistance under load at high currents like those drawn by a starter motor.

On 3/2/2021 at 6:39 PM, Joe Breaux said:

I am in the other hot muggy aligator infested swampland state         Sportsman's Paradise.... Louisiana.... and yes I do eat CRAWFISH ..lol

They're fun to play with--I have  rather large top-water spinner they like to chase...

Travis,

What is the battery voltage, measured at the; 1) battery posts, not cable terminals); and 2) cable terminals (not the battery posts) when cranking or attempting to crank the engine?

Also, what is he voltage between the +battery post and the +terminal on the starter while cranking/trying to crank it over? (this tests the voltage drop, an indicator of the resistance of all wiring, solenoid contacts, etc between in battery and starter..

In the last, what is the voltage between the − battery post and starter body? (this tests the voltage drop in the ground circuit).

These four simple tests (preferably conducted when the engine does mot want to crank) will assess the condition of the battery terminals, all positive wiring and controls of the starter circuit, and all of the return (ground) path. Post what you observe and we can begin to identify (or rule out) any and all potential electrical issues.

-cliff-

Is it as inaccurate as the one I got with my Outfitter 400--which among other things placed the spark plug under the seat (it's not, it's under the cargo bed); and the air filter under the bed (It's not, it's under the seat). Apparently on earlier 400s the cylinder slanted forward, on my 2020 it slants rearward--don't know when that was changed but the OM has yet to catch up with it.

The manual supplied with the vehicle also referenced using the  choke  when starting the engine; it even had an illustration of the nonexistent "choke"--my 2020 is EFI, no choke--it made no mention of the steering column mounted ignition switch/steering lock or horn, light switch/turn signals. The "jump starting" instructions began with "Opening the hood" to access the battery--the battery is under the seat...

I complained to Coleman and they sent me an "updated"manual which corrected the  switch issues but continues to misplace the spark plug ans air filter; and still says "open he hood" to access the battery. Tire pressures provided in the manual(10/10 F/R) are in conflict with the "warning" sticker on the vehicle (12/14 F/R).

The maintenance schedule charts have miles and km change interval labels reversed--I sent them a 30-point correction list 6 weeks ago, have received no response.

Other than that...

2 minutes ago, Joe Breaux said:

unfortunately our gov is left-brained and thinks everyone should put theirs in neutral and let him do all  the thinking for us.. After all, he is so much smarter than we puny humans are .. And obviously masks worked so well that we shattered record after record after record  of China virus cases while we all walked around looking like liquor store robbers with t-shirt material on our faces expecting a single layer  polyester/cotton blend to filter out particles so tiny  that only a microscope can see.. Now he wants another  39 cent /gal tax on gas plus the 22 cents we have now,  and higher tax on all our offroad vehicles to punish us for not " getting with the global warming doctrine "  and buying solar powered 4wd UTVs......... Since  The solar panels worked SO GREAT in Texas last week....   but I digress.......  in related news, my MSU 500 still running perfectly. with a few YAMAHA parts substituted 

If I may be so bold to ask, where are you?

You mean that  "mostly peaceful" virus?

We have not had any of that lockdown nonsense here in Florida, as we are fortunate the have a Governor with an actual functional brain, who respects his constituents and believes we the people when provided with solid, non-sensationalized facts have sense enough to exercise appropriate precautions without being dictated to do so. If "the Donald"  does not run in 2024 and Ron DeSantis does he's got my vote...

I have a Liqui-Vac  "suck-o-matic"¹  2000 2 gallon hand pump vacuum unit I use on our small engines when I get lazy:

I used it on my Outfitter 400 at the first change and got out a tiny bit more than 2 qts.; per factory specs the 400 holds 2.2 with the filter so I got most of it from it from the crankcase and did not have to crawl under it.

Though it goes against my basic nature I may use it again at the next change. If I get 2 qts. again I'll b e a happy camper...

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¹ - I really shouldn't call it that as it works quite well--I've had it for well over 10 years. It's like a vacuum cleaner--they more they suck the better they are.

Spent some time this am looking at shipping options--and find none that make any sense. USPS Priority Mail small flat rate box is $8.00--Parcel Post is $3.30-$4.00 (and I have to  provide packaging). This makes it senseless for me to try to sell them.

So, if anyone finds themselves in the Saint Augustine area give me a yell and I'll give you one...

I appreciate this forum--It would be neat if a bunch of us here could get together, toss back a few pints, and shoot some bull--that would be fun...

^^^ YUP! Imagine if instead we had spent 60 years subsidizing success and achievement !

1 hour ago, Joe Breaux said:

I think that is more the "norm" of modern irresponsible youth who rarely face any consequences for their actions ..My generation appreciated what we had as most of us worked hard to get it .. now kids just put it on the VISA  their mom pays the bill for . When , not if,  they tear it up, mom will buy them another BETTER one .. just my opinion

And it's an entirely valid  opinion--but now yo've got me going, My apologies in advance...I don't get out much anymore...

My mid-20s/early 30s college dropout step-grandsons are just as you describe. Always had all they wanted on a silver platter; the "boys" their mother still calls them.. College (also paid in full by mommy and daddy) was too much like work so they couldn't hack it. The oldest "works" as a barmaid at Starbucks, The other two live in a house mommy & daddy bought for them while still in college and fart around as underlings in the IT industry (that's how daddy made his fortune to support all this silliness) so they get to ride on that.

If you give someone something for nothing that's just exactly what it's worth to them.

Not understanding that was the fundamental flaw in the "Great Society" scheme¹. For  60+ years we as a society have been subsidizing poverty, failure and irresponsibility--and the more of an irresponsible loser you are the more we'll give you. In doing so the leftists created a permanent underclass of  poor, irresponsible, losers--who unfortunately are allowed to vote (the only real reason they are allowed to exist).. 

Often makes me glad I'm going on 75 and in poor health--I won't have to see where this is all going...

“Republics decline into democracies and democracies degenerate into despotisms.”
-Aristotle-

This is where w are now--it's a collective despotism, with respect and authority vested in specific groups,  but despotism nonetheless.

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¹- The Great society was based on a notion that everyone "deserved" a middle-class lifestyle. What was left out was that attaining that would require conducting your self and behaving as a such (which at the time was primarily the "Greatest generation"; founded solidly in work ethic and personal responsibility--Hell, they had just defeated REAL Nazis...   

Here they are at the end of the print cycle (the SLA resin printer "prints" things upside down, the supports [hangers] are needed for dimensional stability:

Ready to be popped off the build plate:

In the "oven" for the final curing:

The "oven is a gutted 0.7 ft³ microwave oven, with nothing left but the turntable and timer. The Magnetron was replaced with a 30 W 405 nm UV LED array. 45 minutes of that fully cures the resin...

The postal service will not let them be shipped in a plain ol' evelope (too thick)--I'll figure out the most economical shipping method and  post a message in the Classified section....

5 minutes ago, T-boss 410 said:

OK, then it's a spool.

Yup... 

The rear track is so narrow there's no real need for a differential--the front OTH has to deal with steering as has been mentioned here, drive it on a hard surface with the differential locked up and the need for same becomes quite apparent.

I agree that the Hisun and other lesser cost Asian ATVs and UTVS are not for those with little to no mechanical knowledge--knew that going in--those who must run to the dealer to have the spark plug and oil changed should not buy one..However,parts for my HS400 seem readily available and the machine itself is remarkable in its simplicity..

What I've seen so far is well-engineered and fabricated, the castings are sturdy and nicely machined (I was surprised tp see forged steel spindles front and rear), and the welds are near perfect.  It has grease fittings everywhere you'd want one and given the overall package size maintenance thingys are quite accessible.

I have no complaints and see no reason why it will not provide a good and long service life. IF I keep it clean and lubricated as required--and do not beat-the-shit out of it as is far too common with this sort of vehicle.  Time will of course be the final arbiter.

My stepson went through a $16000 Yamaha Jet-Ski in less than 9 months--did not follow break-in procedures; or perform early maintenance; and beat the piss out of it every chance he got. He rolled it and sunk it a couple times and didn't even change the oil. 

Unfortunately this is the norm for a lot of motorized recreational toys...

On 1/24/2021 at 1:37 PM, T-boss 410 said:

Hey, I'm just passing along some information I got from a Massimo tech. 

THe Massimo tech was wrong, the vehicle has a final drive gear case, which they incorrectly refer to as the "Rear Differential" in some parts lists I've seen--such as shown below:

However if you study the exploded parts diagram you will see that both axle shafts insert directly into the ring gear hub--there are no side gears, no carrier or spider gears--I.e. no differential. They can call it one but that does no make it one just as calling a cow's tail a leg does not mean a cow has five legs.

My Coleman Outfitter 400 (Hisun HS400) is the same. When I first got it I was surprised by how capable it was in 2WD, then I saw the part disgram and realized it had. in effect,  a full-time "locked" rear end--that explained it...

The front final drive however does have a differential. It is shown in pars lists as an assembly--however it has the distinct shape of an integral ring gear/carrier assembly:

Part #19 above is a sliding splined coupler that in one position locks the differential...