radiator

[nocturnalsixer]

Hello everyone,

I have decided with my Joyner keep overheating only at high speed miles of driving over fifty mph would cause trooper to overheat so the radiator doesn't flow enough and keep getting clogged up with gravel dust

Otherwise at all low speed it work great

i want to know.

Did anyone put in a different radiator?

I'm thinking about a much bigger radiator and e fans set up

[Guest Lenny]

Some of the Troopers seem to have heating problems and other seem to not. Thinking it must be some have some blockage like casting flashing or something inhibiting coolant flow. Adding more fan can help. Moving the radiator up in the air flow helps. As stock there are a couple of design problems. First the fan has a plastic couling which forms a tunnel that the fan blades set in. This plastic round tunnel extends almost all the way to the radiator, like to within 1/4". Some later models have more clearance. Problem with this is that it all but eliminates the corners of the radiator from air flow. First thing is to open up this 1/4" space to at least 1" or more. couple of inches is better.You can trim the couling some but you will also have to space the fan out some. The other problem is that the fan is after the radiator. A fan has a vacume side and a pressure side. The pressure side is where the denser air is and denser air cools better. The fan should be on the inside of the radiator, pushing air thru it. I went to a much bigger radiator and a 3000 cfm fan. I also moved the radiator back to up against the vertical frame bars and put the fan on the inside. I also made a custom shroud to go from the fan to the radiator for complete area flow. Mine gets to about 185 degrees and never budges no matter how i drive it. It just stays rock steady at one temp. And that is cooling for 121 hp. I ran it hard at the Jamboree and the weather was really hot, into the 100s. I tend to go to extreams on things partially because I want it lthe best it can be but also because I have a complete shop which allows me to do things that otherwise would be cost prohibitive for most.

Here is what I sujest. Move the radiator back, this is quite easy. Get a good 3000cfm fan off Ebay, not too expensive, and mount it to the inside of the radiator to blow thru it. Get some 16 gague aluminum sheet from the scrap yard and fashon a shroud that gives a good spread of the air thru the radiator.

See 7 pictures of what I did. The shroud was 1/8" aluminum welded to the radiator then the 16 gauge sheet hand formed and rivited.. First picture shows size difference.

Lenny

[nocturnalsixer]

Thanks a lot Lenny, did you go with generic brand fan? What vehicle was that radiator for?

My temp get about 220 degrees and stay there then my ecm fuse 10 amp blew out.

I have a 84 Corvette radiator I'm thinking about using on the trooper

Also Lenny how did you deal with different hose diameters for radiator?

[rocmoc]

Any good radiator shop can change out the outlets to where ever & want ever size you want. I just had the bottom outlet moved to the other side on my Jeep. I upgraded my original '69 radiator with a much larger & a 3 core radiator out of a '78 Jeep. It cost me $50 to the the outlet moved and the radiator cleaned & checked. I am also adding a dual electric fan setup out of a late '90s Ford product, the V6 or V8 (not the 4 cyl). Seems to be the upgrade setup for Jeeps. Fan with plug in pigtails (wire loom) cost me $40 at the local junk yard, mine is out of a '99 Cougar. The fan pushes around 2600+ CFM and can be setup to run one fan, both fans @ low speed or high speed and off. Should a new fan be required to replace the Ford fan, they sale for $108 on the net at one of the parts sites.

rocmoc n AZ/Mexico

[nocturnalsixer]

Rocmoc i agree i have had great luck in the past with Ford Taurus 3.0 v 6 fans set up i pulled the shroud and writing everything and hooked it up in my 89 s10 it fit like dream

Also will radiator shop change outlet on a plastic/aluminum factory stock radiator?

[Guest Lenny]

The fan is generic off Ebay. The radiatort is 18" x 27" x 2.5" also off Ebay. I don't remember what it was for but I just looked for a size.

Possible radiators

http://www.ebay.com/itm/27-X19-ALUMINUM-RADIATOR-EXTREME-DUTY-HC-6003-RAD-/370577089395?pt=Motors_Car_Truck_Parts_Accessories&hash=item56481da373&vxp=mtr

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Universal-Pro-Cool-GM-Chevy-Aluminum-Radiator-27-x-19-with-Mounting-Holes-/380452931454?pt=Motors_Car_Truck_Parts_Accessories&hash=item5894c3077e&vxp=mtr

radiator fans

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Universal-Pro-Cool-GM-Chevy-Aluminum-Radiator-27-x-19-with-Mounting-Holes-/380452931454?pt=Motors_Car_Truck_Parts_Accessories&hash=item5894c3077e&vxp=mtr

http://www.ebay.com/itm/16-Street-Rod-Radiator-Electric-3000-CFM-Fan-Reversible-Heavy-Duty-NEW-250-W-/270996600203?pt=Motors_Car_Truck_Parts_Accessories&hash=item3f18a7f58b&vxp=mtr

Just check that the two together will fit thickness wise including a shroud.

Lenny

[nocturnalsixer]

Lenny,

I have that upgraded fan i bought it from a dealer that comes on here for $150 live n learn i guess. So ill just need a radiator or use my other extra one

I wonder how did you mount your radiator? I'm not a welder at all

[Guest Lenny]

I welded lugs to the radiators 4 corners and welded matching tabs to the frame. I also used isolating rubber between the lug and tabs along with inbetween the underside of the bolts and he lugs. I made the holes in the tabs quite large so the radiator can move slightly by flexing the rubber. I didn't do this at first and developed a crack where the lug welded to the radiator. There are a variety of ways to mount it including using straps. What ever is secure and works.

Lenny

[rocmoc]

Rocmoc i agree i have had great luck in the past with Ford Taurus 3.0 v 6 fans set up i pulled the shroud and writing everything and hooked it up in my 89 s10 it fit like dream

Also will radiator shop change outlet on a plastic/aluminum factory stock radiator?

I don't know?

Everything I have read does not recommend the plastic tanked/end radiators for off-road use. This is info I have read about on Jeeps.

rocmoc n AZ/Mexico

[nocturnalsixer]

Rocmoc,

Probably because those plastic end tanks would easily break or crack from vibration i think ill look for new aftermarket one maybe even bigger surface area one but with high flow low density fins would be the way to go i believe

[rocmoc]

Rocmoc,

Probably because those plastic end tanks would easily break or crack from vibration i think ill look for new aftermarket one maybe even bigger surface area one but with high flow low density fins would be the way to go i believe

Agree!

[Tinman]

Change the rad fan to a higher end unit, and move or add a warning light to somewhere visible, instead of under the steering wheel. My fan just went today, with 2800 miles on the joyner clock. Luckily, the gurgling of coolant coming out of the reservoir let me know things were too hot before serious engine damage (I hope - checking tomorrow).

[nocturnalsixer]

Change the rad fan to a higher end unit, and move or add a warning light to somewhere visible, instead of under the steering wheel. My fan just went today, with 2800 miles on the joyner clock. Luckily, the gurgling of coolant coming out of the reservoir let me know things were too hot before serious engine damage (I hope - checking tomorrow).

I have a 3000cfm fan on the radiator already and the warning light is in view easily at stock location at end of multiple switch panel.

Im going to buy different radiator then ill let you all know how it do.

Sent from my DROID RAZR using Tapatalk 2

[Neil Wilson]

On 7/7/2012 at 6:51 PM, Lenny said:

As stock there are a couple of design problems. First the fan has a plastic couling which forms a tunnel that the fan blades set in. This plastic round tunnel extends almost all the way to the radiator, like to within 1/4". Some later models have more clearance. Problem with this is that it all but eliminates the corners of the radiator from air flow. First thing is to open up this 1/4" space to at least 1" or more. couple of inches is better.You can trim the couling some but you will also have to space the fan out some. The other problem is that the fan is after the radiator.

In case anyone finds this thread, I have the overheating problem at high speeds (50+ mph). I tried adding space between the radiator and the fan as suggested here. I made a spacer out of 3/4" x 3/4" wood sticks that I found in the Home Depot molding dept. It does seem to help as it takes a little longer to overheat now, but it has not solved the problem. I've tried bleeding the radiator by running it up to temp with the back end elevated. No improvement. I did not see the coolant flowing inside the radiator as I was bleeding it so I suspect the thermostat is not opening properly. Oddly it doesn't overheat any other time, only at sustained high speeds. A stuck thermostat would cause overheating at low speeds too.  Even so I'll replace the thermostat just in case.

 

[Neil Wilson]

I replaced the thermostat and changed the coolant to ensure it was fresh 50/50 mix. Still overheats. My conclusion at this point is the cooling system design is inadequate. I've seen several machines on 4 sale boards with the radiator relocated up behind the cab. This tells me the problem is common and the owners had to change the configuration to solve it. Don't waste your time and money on trying to make it work with the stock configuration. You'll need to upgrade the components or reconfigure it.

[Neil Wilson]

I had suspicions about the gage after an attempt to solve this problem had no impact. I confirmed this by running the machine until the temperature gage was well into the red zone and then measured the temperature of the thermostat housing with an infrared thermometer. The true temperature was 198. Thus the machine is not overheating at all. So the cooling system is fine, it is the gage or the sensor. I wonder about all the machines I've seen where the owners relocated the radiator to behind the cab. Maybe they didn't have a problem at all. 

Anyone who is contemplating moving the radiator should first check the gage.

[Neil Wilson]

On 7/7/2012 at 6:51 PM, Lenny said:

Some of the Troopers seem to have heating problems and other seem to not. Thinking it must be some have some blockage like casting flashing or something inhibiting coolant flow. Adding more fan can help. Moving the radiator up in the air flow helps. As stock there are a couple of design problems. First the fan has a plastic couling which forms a tunnel that the fan blades set in. This plastic round tunnel extends almost all the way to the radiator, like to within 1/4". Some later models have more clearance. Problem with this is that it all but eliminates the corners of the radiator from air flow. First thing is to open up this 1/4" space to at least 1" or more. couple of inches is better.You can trim the couling some but you will also have to space the fan out some. The other problem is that the fan is after the radiator. A fan has a vacume side and a pressure side. The pressure side is where the denser air is and denser air cools better. The fan should be on the inside of the radiator, pushing air thru it. I went to a much bigger radiator and a 3000 cfm fan. I also moved the radiator back to up against the vertical frame bars and put the fan on the inside. I also made a custom shroud to go from the fan to the radiator for complete area flow. Mine gets to about 185 degrees and never budges no matter how i drive it. It just stays rock steady at one temp. And that is cooling for 121 hp. I ran it hard at the Jamboree and the weather was really hot, into the 100s. I tend to go to extreams on things partially because I want it lthe best it can be but also because I have a complete shop which allows me to do things that otherwise would be cost prohibitive for most.

Here is what I sujest. Move the radiator back, this is quite easy. Get a good 3000cfm fan off Ebay, not too expensive, and mount it to the inside of the radiator to blow thru it. Get some 16 gague aluminum sheet from the scrap yard and fashon a shroud that gives a good spread of the air thru the radiator.

See 7 pictures of what I did. The shroud was 1/8" aluminum welded to the radiator then the 16 gauge sheet hand formed and rivited.. First picture shows size difference.

http://thumb12.webshots.net/t/87/187/6/12/32/2529612320104928832zFKacA_th.jpg

Lenny

After reading this post I decided to try moving the fan to the engine side of the radiator and reversed the fan. It makes NO difference.

[mixfixdave]

I replaced my radiator that was leaking/cracked with a half size one that fits a 2000 Acura integra…pretty straightforward and it pretty much resolved my overheating at sustained height rpm’s on asphalt.
If it gets hot on the street, run it below 3500 rpm for a bit.

[Neil Wilson]

On 10/24/2020 at 3:05 PM, Neil Wilson said:

I had suspicions about the gage after an attempt to solve this problem had no impact. I confirmed this by running the machine until the temperature gage was well into the red zone and then measured the temperature of the thermostat housing with an infrared thermometer. The true temperature was 198. Thus the machine is not overheating at all. So the cooling system is fine, it is the gage or the sensor. I wonder about all the machines I've seen where the owners relocated the radiator to behind the cab. Maybe they didn't have a problem at all. 

Anyone who is contemplating moving the radiator should first check the gage.

I ran some more tests using the infrared thermometer. The engine is overheating after all. I've checked everything I can and tried so e of the fixes here. Rather than move the radiator up into the wind, I brought the wind to the radiator using a couple of 4in pvc pipes. That made no difference. My next step is a stronger fan 2400 cfm for $40. After that a new water pump from China. Joyner wants $250 for a pump. China has them for less than $50 shipped. Worth the 3-4 week wait.

[Neil Wilson]

I installed a 2400 cfm fan to see if it solves the problem. It does not. Next step is a new water pump which is en-route from China.

[mixfixdave]

I believe the problem is that at higher rpm’s, the chery 1100 doesn’t have enough water flow capability to dissipate the heat.
Problem is not with the radiator or airflow, it’s related to the water passage sizes inside the engine.
I can hammer at 55 for a while, but eventually have to slow down to 40mph and let the temp gauge come back down.
No problems off-road though.

[Neil Wilson]

3 hours ago, mixfixdave said:

I believe the problem is that at higher rpm’s, the chery 1100 doesn’t have enough water flow capability to dissipate the heat.
Problem is not with the radiator or airflow, it’s related to the water passage sizes inside the engine.
I can hammer at 55 for a while, but eventually have to slow down to 40mph and let the temp gauge come back down.
No problems off-road though.

It puzzles me that Joyner would not have seen the vehicles have overheating issues from their testing prior to issuing them for sale. Also some on the forum say they have no issues. I don't know what to believe. Is it a fundamental deficiency or is there something wrong with my machine? I really doubt I have a bad water pump and I have replaced everything else aside from the radiator itself,  so it is looking like it is a fundamental deficiency. That would explain why I see some machines with the radiator mounted behind the cab. I wish it were a problem I could solve with parts but it looks like I'll have to retrofit a different radiator. If the engine is incapable of circulating enough coolant then there is no solution whatsoever and I am stuck with a machine that can't be fixed.