electric water pump?

[Joe Breaux]

Has anyone tried using an external electric water pump on these machines?  I watched a video on youtube of one installed on a 1000 cc  side by side that had chronic overheating issues in hot weather.. He claimed that after installing a Prius  electric automotive  pump from junk yard, inline in the inlet hose and bypassing fan temp switch,  that the engine never overheated again. .. I am considering trying it on mine...................... Anybody  else done this? .................. He did not say if he removed the mechanical pump or not.. would it pump thru that pump? 

[kenfain]

Pumping through the existing pump, could be possible. But it would seem to somewhat defeat the gains, of using the external pump. My thinking on this, would be that the vanes on the existing pump, would be a drag on the newly created, higher flow system. Eliminating the old pump, however, would create it's own problems. 

 Using both pumps simultaneously, seems like the most likely scenario. Don't know what kind of gains would be achieved though. It might help, or it might create unintended consequences. Like pushing the system pressure too high. 

I think that the whole concept has potential though. If it can be done easily, then give it a try. It might work, and I don't think that it'll be a problem. I'd expect it to help the cooling system somewhat. My guess is, that it'll either help a small amount, or there'll be no improvement. If it could be used with an auxiliary radiator though...that'd be even better!

In the cooling system world. These problems are solved by a bigger radiator core, or a bigger cooling fan. Or as I suggested,  an auxiliary radiator. Pumping faster, or more volume wouldn't achieve much more cooling power. Since the hot coolant isn't exposed to the radiator long enough. That's why you sometimes see those off road desert race trucks. With an extra radiator mounted in the bed.

[Joe Breaux]

well. after 6 trips to shop..replacing the cfracked head, bad gaskets, waterpump and bypassing fan to run 100% ..   NOW  it doesnt run hot anymore.. HOORAY   and that awful heat coming up behind my seat is gone too.. Also removed windshield.. that keeps ME from running hot too .. Guess I wont be needing an electric pump after all..... 

[kenfain]

Glad to hear that you got this problem fixed. Seems like a lot of people are moving towards a full time fan. I certainly hope that it permanently solves the issue.

Let us know how it works out. 

[Dan B]

More benefit would be gained by adding an additional radiator and cooling fan.  That would give the hot water more time exposure to the cooling effects of the additional radiator.  Location of the radiator should be near the same level as the stock radiator.  I don't think the engine driven water pump has enough power to raise the water too high (it's more like a transfer pump, not a pressure pump).  In that case, an additional, electric water pump might be beneficial if it can pump HOT water and survive.  As you've found out, overheating is generally caused by another problem other than design issues.

[Joe Breaux]

Well, I was talking about using an automotive type pump, from a Prius, so hot water would not be an issue.. But since the new  head, head gasket and waterpump replacement and bypassing the fan control to allow 100% fan operation, the engine runs much cooler. probably 40 degrees cooler now.. I dont think   I need additional radiator capacity or electric pump now.. I have run it pretty hard for 3 weekends now and it performed flawlessly in extrmely hot weather ..   I am glad the guy did not take me up on $4900 selling price.. I would not take that now.. I Bought it in  March 2018 , from TS. It only had  300 miles at that time I was willing to sell it,, but it now has 450 miles and runs perfectly thanks to my great mechanic..   With ZERO help from Massimo Ripoff Motors 

[Mackc]

Does the manufacturer of the engine recommend flushing the cooling system when replacing hoses ,water pump or coolant?

FIW;   yes the velocity of the coolant thru the area of the radiator is a big factor in cooling. The velocity of the coolant fluid thru the radiator  (more may not be better) is a big factor in the coolant's heat loss, as is the volume of air passing thru the radiator (more is better)  so keep the radiator air ways clean,. also the chemical makeup of the coolant is a factor. I use 50% distilled water and 50%  good Ethylene-glycol concentrated coolant( Peak, Zerex, Prestone, store brand, I get mine at Tractor Supply, Company) which is also the dealer for my Buck 400 ,   premixed coolant, is fine if you want to pay extra for diluted coolant.

I doubt that having an extra electric pump in line with the original working pump would be a problem. be careful if the original pump us locked up or burned out , it may be better to just replace the original pump.

 

 

 

[Joe Breaux]

as we have now found out, the new waterpump is adequate flow.. The problem lies in the extreme temps Massimo set for electric fan operation.. 210* on the return side of radiator before fan engages.. the engine stays around 230* .. death spiral for heads and head gaskets.and massive heat rising behind my seat!!   . Since repairing damage, and bypassing control to run 100% fan cooling , I have no more overheating issues at all even on very hot days.. 

[Mackc]

being a new Buck 400 owner, It would be nice to know how to by-pass the fan thermostatic switch. I have a don't have a service manual just the poor excuse for a owner's manual, I'm judging because I at one time had a job that required me to write manuals for new engineer recruits, so I do know how detailed manuals need to be, which is hardly what we get now a days, every thing just points us to You Tube GAG GAG!

 

[Lyonel Geary]

I had overheating problems with 2014 Bennche 700 crew.  I often drive slowly through the woods, running my dogs.  I jumped out the high temperature switch on the radiator and installed an electric water pump in the line from the passenger side of the radiator.  The pump I used was from Ebay, item number: 312382485937.  I wired it in parallel with the fan.  I have no more problem.

[Joe Breaux]

Thru trial and error, we found that additional waterflow was unnecessary if you dramatically increase airflow thru radiator by bypassing fan thermoswitch to allow fan to run 100%.. Mine now runs cool.. no more overheating even on extremely hot days 

[Mackc]

On 8/17/2020 at 1:21 PM, Joe Breaux said:

well. after 6 trips to shop..replacing the cfracked head, bad gaskets, waterpump and bypassing fan to run 100% ..   NOW  it doesnt run hot anymore.. HOORAY   and that awful heat coming up behind my seat is gone too.. Also removed windshield.. that keeps ME from running hot too .. Guess I wont be needing an electric pump after all..... 

Your Solution: by bypassing fan thermoswitch to allow fan to run 100%..

My Question, exactlely where is the thermoswitch located? and would you please post a picture of this Thermoswitch which appears to be a relay triggered by a heat coil. Is that correct?

[Joe Breaux]

on mine, the switch which turns the fan on and off  at preset temps is located on passenger side of radiator . Fan is NOT controlled by ECU. .it has a 2 wire plug-in.. simply unplug and jump the 2 wires .. Fan will then run when key is turned on.. mine was running 230-240 degress causing masive overheating and parts failure.. it now stays 170-180 degress on 100 degree days .. that switch was factory set way too high ..we used a infrared thermometer, the switch would not turn on til 220 degees and turned off at 190 .. but its on the return side .. thats how hot the water was going TO the engine.. poor design ...I tried to find a switch with low set temps or adjustable temps but could not .... Anyway, waterflow is adequate, it just needs far more cooling of the water BEFORE it returns to engine..  Thats my opinion at least. My mechanic agrees .. AND ITS WORKING.. I can run it hard all day... never runs hot now 

[Mackc]

Thanks Joe, I will have to see if I can even get to the radiator. This thing is almost all enclosed in plastic! The service manual has a lot of information, but is sadly missing any "how to get to" pictures and information.  If I figure it out I will try to keep good notes to be posted here. 

 

[Mackc]

So as I understand it, To make the fan run 100% of when the switch is on is to find the Thermoswitch that screws into the bottom of the radiator on the passenger side of the radiator and jumper the two wires and just leave the thermoswitch without any wires? is that correct?

Also I haven't seen any conversations about the engine thermostat, has anyone had to replace the engine thermostat because it fails to operate properly?

[Lyonel Geary]

My 2014 700 EFI, has no thermostat.  There is a place for one, but is empty.

[Joe Breaux]

 Yep, leave switch installed, just bypass it.. tape the wires   so water doesnt get in ............Not using Thermostat in mine either.. If you live in very cold climate you probably need one but then, you probably dont overheat in 0 degree weather 

[Mackc]

If I  can get the wires to unplug I will jumper them, if they won't unplug I will cut and tie them together and put a oilfield 10,000 PSI tape job on them like I did on  a drillpipe back off stringshot 

[Joe Breaux]

haha.. yeah, we like to tighten bolts 'Oilfield tight" around here too.. Thats tighten down til it twists off, then back off 1/4 turn 

[Arkansasjumper]

For those who maybe concerned about their fan running 100 percent of the time like in really cold weather, I found a solution. I bypassed the thermostat like Joe said but I wired each end and tied them into a standard 20amp rocker switch. Now I manually control turning the fan on and off. Got the stuff at auto parts store and did install about 30 minutes. 

[Joe Breaux]

1 hour ago, Arkansasjumper said:

For those who maybe concerned about their fan running 100 percent of the time like in really cold weather, I found a solution. I bypassed the thermostat like Joe said but I wired each end and tied them into a standard 20amp rocker switch. Now I manually control turning the fan on and off. Got the stuff at auto parts store and did install about 30 minutes. 

That works but I did one better.. Bought an automotive aftermarket fan controller with probe,  thats adjustable from 130 degress to 220 degrees .. I have it set at 160* to come on, 140* to turn off  ... Engine warms up in cold weather.. we had 15 degrees here this year.. worked just fine ..AND  I no longer have any overheating issues no matter how hard I run it or how hot a day it is..