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    #41 rocmoc

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    Posted 09 May 2011 - 08:57 PM

    Go for it,, then you can do all the testing,& dyno's you want,,,,,,,, I'm very happy with all the updates I've had done to mine....even if they just " Feel" better? lmao,,,Quig



    Didn't mean or try to offend!

    Why are people so edgy?

    rocmoc n AZ

    rocmoc n AZ/Mexico

    #42 rocmoc

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    Posted 09 May 2011 - 09:00 PM

    Never fear, Lennys here. You didn't think with all the mods I have put on my Trooper I would skip the Cam upgrade did you? Talked with Rick at Silverbullet today and I'm getting his next set of cams. I put off the dyno tuning work that was scheduled for tomorrow near Las Vegas. Planned on taking it in as long as I was going there anyway for a trade show. I should get the cams in about a week or two and should have the dyno tuning with the new cams shortly after, Want it done for the Jamboree. I should have dyno print outs for torque and HP but it won't show the difference from a stock engine being that mine is ported, and port matched, changed compression ratio, supercharged, aftercooled, running a stand alone computer (Megasquirt) and after installed, aftermarket cams. But I have a good feel for the power I have now and should see a nice increase in low to midrange torque. This setup should make my setup killer in the sand dunes and power sliding the corners on the trails should be a riot. Like Rocmoc said the diff is always a concern but I don't plan on forcing it too much. Keep in mind that if the diff is going to tear up it will be when pulling hard in 1st gear. This puts more stress on the diff then any other gear can. Also when in 1st gear you are generally also in 4x4 so the front diff shares some of the stress but not always. The extra power I have and will have, will be used in the higher gears. I don't need more power in 1st gear. I can already pretty much pull anything I want in 1st. When I was stock, to get it to go in 1st gear up a tough section, I would have the engine reving at 5000 + rpms. The wheels would spin and then catch. This had to put a very heavy tug on the diff and probably more then I will be applying when I'm crawling up sections at a much slower speed because of the extra torque at lower rpms. Even though I'll have considerably more torque, I won't be jamming the diff like when it would spin and catch before. I know, it all sounds good but time will tell on the diffs. If I was still a kid, they wouldn't last past the first day. You know how it was when you were young and didn't really know what you were doing. You would rev the engine and let the clutch fly. Aging has mellowed out how I apply power. I think the diff will hold if I don't try to jerk the 1800 pound Trooper around but ease power on instead. The higher low end torque allows that.

    Lenny



    LOL! I almost called you out Lenny but thought I would wait to see if you were going this route. Problem is comparing your Trooper to mine is like comparing a Corvette to a VW.

    rocmoc n AZ

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    #43 Quig

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    Posted 09 May 2011 - 09:19 PM

    Didn't mean or try to offend!

    Why are people so edgy?

    rocmoc n AZ

    Not offended or edgy,, just really don't have money to do dyno's,"don't want to" No very good way to ck improvements,other than how it feels.. Thats all I care about ,,, how smooth it rides, how good it turns, how good it climbs hills,,"feels" like driving automatic,now with fuel controller,

    Quote Lenny: But I have a good feel for the power I have now and should see a nice increase in low to midrange torque. This setup should make my setup killer in the sand dunes and power sliding the corners

    Wasn't trying to cause problem,, lmao : )


    #44 2scoops

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    Posted 10 May 2011 - 08:57 AM

    Never fear, Lennys here. You didn't think with all the mods I have put on my Trooper I would skip the Cam upgrade did you? Talked with Rick at Silverbullet today and I'm getting his next set of cams. I put off the dyno tuning work that was scheduled for tomorrow near Las Vegas. Planned on taking it in as long as I was going there anyway for a trade show. I should get the cams in about a week or two and should have the dyno tuning with the new cams shortly after, Want it done for the Jamboree. I should have dyno print outs for torque and HP but it won't show the difference from a stock engine being that mine is ported, and port matched, changed compression ratio, supercharged, aftercooled, running a stand alone computer (Megasquirt) and after installed, aftermarket cams. But I have a good feel for the power I have now and should see a nice increase in low to midrange torque. This setup should make my setup killer in the sand dunes and power sliding the corners on the trails should be a riot. Like Rocmoc said the diff is always a concern but I don't plan on forcing it too much. Keep in mind that if the diff is going to tear up it will be when pulling hard in 1st gear. This puts more stress on the diff then any other gear can. Also when in 1st gear you are generally also in 4x4 so the front diff shares some of the stress but not always. The extra power I have and will have, will be used in the higher gears. I don't need more power in 1st gear. I can already pretty much pull anything I want in 1st. When I was stock, to get it to go in 1st gear up a tough section, I would have the engine reving at 5000 + rpms. The wheels would spin and then catch. This had to put a very heavy tug on the diff and probably more then I will be applying when I'm crawling up sections at a much slower speed because of the extra torque at lower rpms. Even though I'll have considerably more torque, I won't be jamming the diff like when it would spin and catch before. I know, it all sounds good but time will tell on the diffs. If I was still a kid, they wouldn't last past the first day. You know how it was when you were young and didn't really know what you were doing. You would rev the engine and let the clutch fly. Aging has mellowed out how I apply power. I think the diff will hold if I don't try to jerk the 1800 pound Trooper around but ease power on instead. The higher low end torque allows that.

    Lenny



    First of all, I wanted to say I am absolutely impressed and amazed at the resolve it must have taken you to complete all of those engine upgrades. I hope it exceeds your expectations! So, when can I drop my Trooper off to Lenny's race factory? How much?

    Second, I hear all of the concerns with our rear diff. Now, considered if we do the upgraded kit, get everything aligned properly, is it still considered a weak diff? I mean it is HUGE. It has to be twice the size of a RZR's. Are we saying it is overall just weak, or are we just saying it is the weakest link in the chain? Cause even on the best built rock crawler, the differentials & axles although beefed up, are still the weakest link due to the torque applied on them. Is that what we are saying about ours? Or, is there a better option our there for strength in the UTV market?

    Last, am I not supposed to rev the engine and let the clutch fly? Is it bad to constantly bounce off of the rev limiter? If that is bad then I don't want to be good B)


    #45 Lenny

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    Posted 10 May 2011 - 09:55 AM

    First of all, I wanted to say I am absolutely impressed and amazed at the resolve it must have taken you to complete all of those engine upgrades. I hope it exceeds your expectations! So, when can I drop my Trooper off to Lenny's race factory? How much?

    Second, I hear all of the concerns with our rear diff. Now, considered if we do the upgraded kit, get everything aligned properly, is it still considered a weak diff? I mean it is HUGE. It has to be twice the size of a RZR's. Are we saying it is overall just weak, or are we just saying it is the weakest link in the chain? Cause even on the best built rock crawler, the differentials & axles although beefed up, are still the weakest link due to the torque applied on them. Is that what we are saying about ours? Or, is there a better option our there for strength in the UTV market?

    Last, am I not supposed to rev the engine and let the clutch fly? Is it bad to constantly bounce off of the rev limiter? If that is bad then I don't want to be good B)


    The project sort of evolved. To get to this point, it included a lot of reworking. My supercharger is in it's third location. Each time an improvement but a lot of hours, fabrication and machining. It would be hard to put a price on it but supercharger kits will be available at some point. My wife keeps reminding me of what I said when I bought the Trooper. It has lots of power, it's built heavy so we shouldn't have to put extra money into it to bring it up to expectations. Didn't take long before I saw areas that needed changing. It hasn't stopped since.

    The diffs have not been assembled correctly from the factory and they should have used stronger bolts while securing them better from coming loose. Loosening bolts leads to diff failure. Mis-aligned gears leads to gear failure. Loose tollerances leads to extra stress being applied to the internals. So far I haven't heard of anyone that has actually tore teeth off the gears because the teeth just couldn't take the torque. I tore up a ring gear, stripped the teeth off but this was my own fault. Even though it was upgraded, thanks to attention deficit, I forgot to restrain the pinion gear from being able to move towards the center of the ring gear. When this happens, the larger part of the pinion teeth try to mesh with the narrower part of the ring gear, thus wedging hard inbetween them. This wedging action brakes the ring gear teeth off. I have as I'm sure others have at times, when in a steep rock section, had to rev the engine way up while letting the clutch out to get every bit of torque to the wheels that I could just to get going and didn't tear out the diff. In this kind of situation, the vast majority of the weight is on the rear wheels. I remember being concerned about coming over backwards. All in all, I think the diff will hold a fair amount of torque and should last quite a while. Are they built as good as a typical automotive diff? I would say no. If mine ever fail, I plan on trying to fine a different diff. It's finding one that locks out is hard. I would rather not have to attempt to convert a standard diff to a locking diff. If I ever do go to another diff, I'll lower my ratio from stock (I'm running Renegade pinion gears) from about 2.3:1 to about 3:1. I dont need a lot of speed and still could probably go 55-60 mph with my 31" tires. This would bring my shifted gearing closer together that should help in the trails when hot rodding.

    Reving the engine and letting the clutch fly like your trying to burn out on pavement is very hard on it. Reving the engine and kind of easing the clutch out isn't too bad. The rev limiter is there to protect the engine and prevent over reving. I don't see any problem with the engine reving to the rev limit and cutting out until rpms lower. Now days engines are reved much more then in the past but, I'm old school and prefer to work with torque rather then screaming the engine. The Chery engine seems to be a real solid engine and I think it can take the revs.

    Lenny


    #46 2scoops

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    Posted 10 May 2011 - 10:14 AM

    The project sort of evolved. To get to this point, it included a lot of reworking. My supercharger is in it's third location. Each time an improvement but a lot of hours, fabrication and machining. It would be hard to put a price on it but supercharger kits will be available at some point. My wife keeps reminding me of what I said when I bought the Trooper. It has lots of power, it's built heavy so we shouldn't have to put extra money into it to bring it up to expectations. Didn't take long before I saw areas that needed changing. It hasn't stopped since.

    The diffs have not been assembled correctly from the factory and they should have used stronger bolts while securing them better from coming loose. Loosening bolts leads to diff failure. Mis-aligned gears leads to gear failure. Loose tollerances leads to extra stress being applied to the internals. So far I haven't heard of anyone that has actually tore teeth off the gears because the teeth just couldn't take the torque. I tore up a ring gear, stripped the teeth off but this was my own fault. Even though it was upgraded, thanks to attention deficit, I forgot to restrain the pinion gear from being able to move towards the center of the ring gear. When this happens, the larger part of the pinion teeth try to mesh with the narrower part of the ring gear, thus wedging hard inbetween them. This wedging action brakes the ring gear teeth off. I have as I'm sure others have at times, when in a steep rock section, had to rev the engine way up while letting the clutch out to get every bit of torque to the wheels that I could just to get going and didn't tear out the diff. In this kind of situation, the vast majority of the weight is on the rear wheels. I remember being concerned about coming over backwards. All in all, I think the diff will hold a fair amount of torque and should last quite a while. Are they built as good as a typical automotive diff? I would say no. If mine ever fail, I plan on trying to fine a different diff. It's finding one that locks out is hard. I would rather not have to attempt to convert a standard diff to a locking diff. If I ever do go to another diff, I'll lower my ratio from stock (I'm running Renegade pinion gears) from about 2.3:1 to about 3:1. I dont need a lot of speed and still could probably go 55-60 mph with my 31" tires. This would bring my shifted gearing closer together that should help in the trails when hot rodding.

    Reving the engine and letting the clutch fly like your trying to burn out on pavement is very hard on it. Reving the engine and kind of easing the clutch out isn't too bad. The rev limiter is there to protect the engine and prevent over reving. I don't see any problem with the engine reving to the rev limit and cutting out until rpms lower. Now days engines are reved much more then in the past but, I'm old school and prefer to work with torque rather then screaming the engine. The Chery engine seems to be a real solid engine and I think it can take the revs.

    Lenny


    So will you be marketing the supercharger kit? A ball park price would be nice, so I can start saving my pennys.


    #47 Lenny

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    Posted 10 May 2011 - 01:24 PM

    So will you be marketing the supercharger kit? A ball park price would be nice, so I can start saving my pennys.


    No, I won't be offering it but I do know it's being worked on by others.

    Lenny


    #48 ricksrb

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    Posted 10 May 2011 - 01:38 PM

    No, I won't be offering it but I do know it's being worked on by others.

    Lenny


    Cmon Lenny,you dont have anything else to do..(LOL)

    Yours,
    Rick
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    #49 Mopartist

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    Posted 10 May 2011 - 04:29 PM

    Hey Lenny; if the timing would have been right; I HAD a narrowed Dana 60 with 4:10s I would have made you a killer deal on! (Kidding of coarse) You could NEVER break that! Heh heh! :lol: Rated up to 800 HP at the wheels.
    That was "Pre" Trooper though.

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