Travis Posted February 4, 2021 Author Share #211 Posted February 4, 2021 My + cable also tested with the same resistance, not sure when that one is supposed to get here though, guess ill order a ground cable too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Travis Posted February 4, 2021 Author Share #212 Posted February 4, 2021 Holy cow.... $25 for that ground cable! heck it's shorter then the dang + cable! $21 at partzilla. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
T-boss 410 Posted February 4, 2021 Share #213 Posted February 4, 2021 Are those cables very elaborate? I considered making my own, but I don't have the correct gauge wire. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Travis Posted February 4, 2021 Author Share #214 Posted February 4, 2021 here we go... Made in the US of A.... https://www.amazon.com/Spartan-Power-Negative-Connecting-Batteries/dp/B07HBNKVTR/ref=sr_1_11?dchild=1&keywords=ground%2Bcable&qid=1612400495&sr=8-11&th=1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Travis Posted February 4, 2021 Author Share #215 Posted February 4, 2021 3 minutes ago, T-boss 410 said: Are those cables very elaborate? I considered making my own, but I don't have the correct gauge wire. the negative is just a a regular cable, coated with rubber. the + cable has a white wire made onto it that has a diode and 20 amp main fuse that goes to the keyswitch. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Travis Posted February 4, 2021 Author Share #216 Posted February 4, 2021 hold the phone, I forgot i have a short red wire that i had bought that's a Briggs part... technically it's a + cable, but a cable is a cable, it might reach to from the battery to the where the ground point is. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
T-boss 410 Posted February 4, 2021 Share #217 Posted February 4, 2021 Gotcha. Mine doesn't have that diode. Mine has a cable from the battery to the solenoid, and from the solenoid to the starter. There's also one from the battery to the wiring harness. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Travis Posted February 4, 2021 Author Share #218 Posted February 4, 2021 Okay, that cable i have on hand will work perfectly, ends are sealed too. i cut a strip of black heat shrink tube and put on it so i won't cross them up. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
T-boss 410 Posted February 4, 2021 Share #219 Posted February 4, 2021 Hope it works for you! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kenfain Posted February 4, 2021 Share #220 Posted February 4, 2021 3 minutes ago, Travis said: Okay, that cable i have on hand will work perfectly, ends are sealed too. i cut a strip of black heat shrink tube and put on it so i won't cross them up. They sell pre made cables at tractor supply. All different lengths. But marking the ground...that works too. Good luck! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Travis Posted February 4, 2021 Author Share #221 Posted February 4, 2021 2 minutes ago, kenfain said: They sell pre made cables at tractor supply. All different lengths. But marking the ground...that works too. Good luck! Really?! i've never seen any cables at my TSC, in Willis or Conroe... i'll have to look closer Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kenfain Posted February 4, 2021 Share #222 Posted February 4, 2021 44 minutes ago, Travis said: Really?! i've never seen any cables at my TSC, in Willis or Conroe... i'll have to look closer They're on the wall by the batteries. Along with the battery accessory stuff. They're generic lengths, sold by inches. So know how long you need it to be. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Travis Posted February 4, 2021 Author Share #223 Posted February 4, 2021 +Positive cable ain't gonna be here for 2 weeks.... Guess i'll head to TSC tomorrow and look, or order a + cable like i listed earlier. and put a ring terminal on that white wire. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Travis Posted February 4, 2021 Author Share #224 Posted February 4, 2021 just now, i took off the flywheel housing, so i can see the ring gear and starter gear, whenever the starter clicks, there is no sign of outward movement of the starter gear.. so it's something internally in the starter i think...but what? also read something interesting, bad cables can (of course deliver lower amperage) and that can burn out solenoids..... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kenfain Posted February 4, 2021 Share #225 Posted February 4, 2021 Since you're replacing the cables, and you have a known good solenoid. That's a good starting point for finding your problem. You should be seeing that new multimeter soon. New parts, and a few quick tests, should start getting some answers. Unfortunately I have no idea what is considered normal amp draw for yours, (or mine either). You should be able to get that same information from the internet, or maybe the manufacturer, hopefully on their website. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
T-boss 410 Posted February 4, 2021 Share #226 Posted February 4, 2021 I guess that if the starter wasn't being supplied with enough current, that it wouldn't kick the gear out to engage the flywheel, but it would be enough to spin the motor. But unfortunately, these days you just can't trust that parts will function properly for a long period of time. If you remove the starter and hook it up to a known good battery, does it kick the gear out? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Travis Posted February 4, 2021 Author Share #227 Posted February 4, 2021 27 minutes ago, T-boss 410 said: I guess that if the starter wasn't being supplied with enough current, that it wouldn't kick the gear out to engage the flywheel, but it would be enough to spin the motor. But unfortunately, these days you just can't trust that parts will function properly for a long period of time. If you remove the starter and hook it up to a known good battery, does it kick the gear out? I'm not pulling that starter off until i get the new cable. I'm almost ready to screw it and live with it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
T-boss 410 Posted February 4, 2021 Share #228 Posted February 4, 2021 Just a thought. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Travis Posted February 4, 2021 Author Share #229 Posted February 4, 2021 45 minutes ago, kenfain said: Since you're replacing the cables, and you have a known good solenoid. That's a good starting point for finding your problem. You should be seeing that new multimeter soon. New parts, and a few quick tests, should start getting some answers. Unfortunately I have no idea what is considered normal amp draw for yours, (or mine either). You should be able to get that same information from the internet, or maybe the manufacturer, hopefully on their website. me either, all i know kawasaki recommends (stock) a 235CCA battery, and i have a 270 in it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Travis Posted February 4, 2021 Author Share #230 Posted February 4, 2021 here's something to chew on! Lol wouldn't start earlier, clicked about 40 times.. this time, I went from the + on the solenoid and unplugged where the trigger wire goes, and shorted from the big + to trigger tab, and it fired right up. That big + has more amps than that little wire... Sooo is for some reason, i am not getting enough amperage through the trigger to retract the solenoid completely, SOMETIMES? Or is it in the starter causing it need to more amperage to retract the solenoid SOMETIMES.? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Travis Posted February 5, 2021 Author Share #231 Posted February 5, 2021 Okay, i put the spare solenoid on, (of course i had to remove the starter to do that ) so while the starter was on the bench, i hooked up a good battery to it. and it spun up every time HOWEVER, the way i'm triggering the solenoid is jumping from the + (alot of amps) to the trigger tab with a 18 gauge wire. Now, i did clean up the starter gear and clutch and WD 40'd it, and that seemed to help a little bit, it turned it over a few times before it started clicking again, back on the mule. Of course i've read about the starter needing shimmed and what not, but i highly doubt that it's the case as the starter worked great for a month and a half before any problems occured. Teeth were in good shape also. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Travis Posted February 5, 2021 Author Share #232 Posted February 5, 2021 Okay, here's what's happening. i removed the flywheel housing again, and whenever the starter clicks, it only moves, maybe a 1/8" of an inch? It isn't hitting the flywheel and stopping, it's just bare moving. i'll try to record a video. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
T-boss 410 Posted February 5, 2021 Share #233 Posted February 5, 2021 Is the cable the same gauge from the battery to the starter? Sounds like something is dropping the amps from the battery to the solenoid. I don't understand how your starter works, since it doesn't have a bendix to push the gear out to contact the flywheel. But if it was working properly after installing the new one, I would have to believe that it was something internal with the starter. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Travis Posted February 5, 2021 Author Share #234 Posted February 5, 2021 3 minutes ago, T-boss 410 said: Is the cable the same gauge from the battery to the starter? Sounds like something is dropping the amps from the battery to the solenoid. I don't understand how your starter works, since it doesn't have a bendix to push the gear out to contact the flywheel. But if it was working properly after installing the new one, I would have to believe that it was something internal with the starter. scrap what i said in the last post. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Travis Posted February 5, 2021 Author Share #235 Posted February 5, 2021 Okay, i was able to contort my body into a position where i could see the flywheel gear much better. and used the weight of a pair of vice grips to hold the key in START. i then got a screwdriver and moved the flywheel a hair, and when i say HAIR, i mean a HAIR.. and the starter kicked over and engaged and spun the engine. Now 2 things, Is it a issue with the flywheel teeth, Or: The clutch on the starter gear is designed to spin freely 1 way, and spin the motor the way that allows the gear to move independently of the shaft so it can mesh with the teeth on the flywheel, then it spins the engine over. SO I DON'T FREAKING KNOW OR is the starter not getting enough amperage to overcome that friction??? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Travis Posted February 5, 2021 Author Share #236 Posted February 5, 2021 Another thing, from the factory the starter comes with 2 holes in it on the bottom. One hole is plugged. The other is not. I just wonder if fine dust from riding is getting in there and over a period of starts wears on the support shaft bushing surfaces and wears them to the point where the shaft isn't aligned with the ring gear on the fly wheel. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
T-boss 410 Posted February 5, 2021 Share #237 Posted February 5, 2021 Is there play in the starter shaft? Or did the clutch for the flywheel wear enough to throw the flywheel out of alignment enough to jamb the starter gear and prevent it from contacting the flywheel? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Travis Posted February 5, 2021 Author Share #238 Posted February 5, 2021 I'll have to pull the starter and check for how much slack is in it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Travis Posted February 5, 2021 Author Share #239 Posted February 5, 2021 1 hour ago, T-boss 410 said: Is the cable the same gauge from the battery to the starter? Sounds like something is dropping the amps from the battery to the solenoid. I don't understand how your starter works, since it doesn't have a bendix to push the gear out to contact the flywheel. But if it was working properly after installing the new one, I would have to believe that it was something internal with the starter. Solenoid shift. there is a piece that the solenoid clips to, that piece is attached to the starter gear, when the solenoid retracts, that causes the bottom of the piece to move the opposite direction pushing the starter gear outwards. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
T-boss 410 Posted February 5, 2021 Share #240 Posted February 5, 2021 Don't forget to check the flywheel also, if you can. I would think that, with the hours on it and the starter being new, that the flywheel would be the suspect this time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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